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[Matchday] [Champions League] Man Utd vs.Sevilla (13/03/18) 2nd Leg KO Stage
14-03-2018, 08:09 AM (This post was last modified: 14-03-2018 08:24 AM by Costas.)
Post: #61
RE: [Champions League] Man Utd vs.Sevilla (13/03/18) 2nd Leg KO Stage
(14-03-2018 04:55 AM)Balaji Sivaraman Wrote:  The manager of Manchester United had this to say after they had just crashed out of the Champions Leage: "I don't want to make a drama of it. That’s football, it is not the end of the world. I sit in this chair twice in the CL and knocked Man United out with Porto and Real Madrid so it is not something new for the club."

Go on. Defend this guy for me. I stayed awake till 3.30AM on a workday to watch us put on a shitshow. I have done the same for every nightly game since Sir Alex Ferguson retired. Every game, I hope that this will be the one where the real Manchester United will show up.

And this is the response I get from our condescending prick of a manager. Fuck this cunt off right back to Portugal.

If football isn't "the end of the world", then how come he keeps getting into hissy fights with any pundit who dares question his ability as a football manager? He knows that he got embarrassed last night and he can't even brush it off anymore.

And in the same presser he brought up knocking out United with Porto and Real. Living in the past. Again. This is Mourinho in numbers: In the last 8 years he's won just 2 big trophies: a league title with Real and one with Chelsea. Having spent 820 million in total (and I overlook the fact that when he went to Real he inherited players like Ronaldo, Kaka and Benzema)! He doesn't even classify as one of the best managers in the world anymore.

He also said that we need to spend more. Who the fuck is he kidding? Sevilla's squad cost 200 million less than ours and they outplayed us in both games. They didn't only want to attack more than we did, but they actually played good football. What did we play? What's our style? Lump it to Lukaku and hope for the best? He spent 300 million and has the likes of Pogba, Martial, Rashford, Mata and Sanchez at his disposal and this is how he gets the best out of them? Hell, the league's 2 best players (De Bruyne and Salah) are players Mourinho saw nothing in them. That says it all. But I guess it's easier to attack Neville, Scholes, Souness or De Boer than face the truth.

Pathetic. Washed up. Has been.
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14-03-2018, 09:30 AM
Post: #62
RE: [Champions League] Man Utd vs.Sevilla (13/03/18) 2nd Leg KO Stage
The moment I post this, I know people are mostly going to call out Souness for being a scouse bastard. But everything he says here is spot fucking on.



"I've spent 25 years of my life pushing this club forward and not only could I not have done it without those fans, I do it for them." - Sir Alex
"Whatever we are, whatever we make of ourselves, is all we will ever have – and that, in its profound simplicity, is the meaning of life." - Phillip Appleman
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14-03-2018, 09:44 AM
Post: #63
RE: [Champions League] Man Utd vs.Sevilla (13/03/18) 2nd Leg KO Stage
Scholesy sums up how United fans are feeling right now.

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"I've spent 25 years of my life pushing this club forward and not only could I not have done it without those fans, I do it for them." - Sir Alex
"Whatever we are, whatever we make of ourselves, is all we will ever have – and that, in its profound simplicity, is the meaning of life." - Phillip Appleman
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14-03-2018, 11:58 AM (This post was last modified: 14-03-2018 12:18 PM by BuffaloRed.)
Post: #64
RE: [Champions League] Man Utd vs.Sevilla (13/03/18) 2nd Leg KO Stage
Rocky Ray Hudson on satellite had a 10 minute rant that would have curled your hair and made Pappii and Costas sound like choir boys. And everything he said was dead on. If Jose had said I fucked up my tactics were wrong this one is on me, I could say maybe he will learn. No idea where United goes from here.

On a funnier/creepier note the Mirror published a video of a fan teasing Jamie Carragher while driving saying 2-1 mate so the idiot spat at the United fan’s car and hits his 14 year old daughter in the passenger seat. Now Carragher is suspended from his punditry job. All caught on video
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14-03-2018, 01:20 PM
Post: #65
RE: [Champions League] Man Utd vs.Sevilla (13/03/18) 2nd Leg KO Stage
Buffalo - Saw that nasty spitting clip. The father and Carragher are pure scum IMO. What kind of man spits on a child and what kind of man gets a buzz from that incident. The daughter didn't deserve that.

If Jose came out and slammed the players and said there future's are not safe, no matter the price tag or popularity I would have backed him. Sanchez and Pogba have been abysmal, had he laid blame on the players, it would have shown some kind of accountability.

But instead we got nothing. Throwing players under buses is not a regular thing which is why the odd time it is done. It has to be timed well and effective.

Simply Jose has no excuses, like LVG he doesn't want to be honest with the fans and clearly he isn't a lover of the game.. He just works in it and plays it but his disregard for the club and its fans says alot.

Its inexcusable, this wasn't Bristol or Mk Don's or Huddersfield or Newcastle. It was a poor Sevilla side in the champions fucking league.

Waiting for XSA view on this doom and gloom.
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14-03-2018, 05:48 PM
Post: #66
RE: [Champions League] Man Utd vs.Sevilla (13/03/18) 2nd Leg KO Stage
To be honest, I would have gone easier on Mourinho if he hadn't made such a mug out of himself on Monday. It's not like De Boer is a relative of mine, but why on Earth is our manager focused on taking shots at critics 24 hours before such a crucial game? It used to be that Mourinho's classless rants would be labeled as "mind games", but we are so removed from that now. If he cares more about his fragile ego than he is about the job he's paid to do, then he is not good enough to be this club's manager. Regardless of his style of play or if he's getting the best out of his expenside squad. Pains me to say, but Sir Bobby and everyone else who was apprehensive about hiring him 2 years ago, was right on the money. And I was deluded to think that we would get the Mourinho of 2005 and not an insecure bitter middle aged man.

Anyway, I didn't have much sympathy for Carragher until I saw his interview on Sky the day after. Man, talk about trying to rub a dog's nose in his own shit! I don't condone what Carragher did. He was an idiot and he let his dipper side get the best of him. But I am sick to death of crucifying someone for a mistake over and over. When is enough enough? He should have been heavily fined and that should have been the end of it. Meanwhile, few people condemn the scum of a father who shoots a cell phone video while he is driving and he has a 14 year old kid in the car. Even his daughter is telling him to stop messing with Carragher around and to pay attention on the road.
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14-03-2018, 07:14 PM
Post: #67
RE: [Champions League] Man Utd vs.Sevilla (13/03/18) 2nd Leg KO Stage
Costas

My dislike for Jose is on the pitch and training ground. I won't measure him to the standards of Van Gaal, Moyes and hell not even to our legendary god that is Fergie. But I will measure him up to his peers.

I don't want a manager to be my idol or some happy laughing clown. I want our manager to be "special" and to be a representative of the mantra of this club and its ethos under Fergie and Busby.

Mourinho has done a good job. He's done the job Van Gaal was meant to do.

Mourinho has laid down foundations for the future and those standards will stay with the club until a huge chunk of those players depart.

I think Jose should try and win the FA Cup and leave with 2nd and his head held high. Don't be like LVG, leave with some dignity and self respect.

If I were Woody, Jardim and Allegri are front runners. Both men are coming to the end of their spells at Juve and Monaco and can only achieve so little more with what they have.

This is simply a footballing issue, we need an attacking coach who will develop youth and pick the best team and not the biggest names.

Jose has caved to commercial pressures.
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16-03-2018, 04:01 PM
Post: #68
RE: [Champions League] Man Utd vs.Sevilla (13/03/18) 2nd Leg KO Stage
Anyone watch Jose's ridiculously embarrassing rant at his presser today? More cringe worthy than FSWs facts by a long shot, the man is a cancer who'll blame anyone but himself. The sooner we're rid of the better.
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16-03-2018, 05:00 PM (This post was last modified: 16-03-2018 05:06 PM by Costas.)
Post: #69
RE: [Champions League] Man Utd vs.Sevilla (13/03/18) 2nd Leg KO Stage
JC, remember a couple of months back when I posted his infamous 7 minute rant after Southampton beat Chelsea at the Bridge in 2015 and said that this will be our future at some point? Well, this is what we got today. No respect to his FA cup opponents, the fans who rightfully feel disillusioned or even his own players (notice how many times he says "I beat" or "I won"). Just a lengthy drivel about how he's our gift from heaven and how dare we question him. Whatever truth is in this rant is lost in his own arrogance, ego, selective memory and fact bending:





I still don't get why we extended his contract before we could even assess what he did this season. I guess for Woodward and the Glazers it's enough that we have a manager who delivers the Arsenal formula of "success": Champions League football and the odd minor cup.
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16-03-2018, 06:25 PM (This post was last modified: 16-03-2018 06:27 PM by Clint-TheyCallMePapii.)
Post: #70
RE: [Champions League] Man Utd vs.Sevilla (13/03/18) 2nd Leg KO Stage
What an idiot, is that what he does with his time? Prepare himself rather than prepare the team?

The last thing we need is for Woodward to back Mourinho like the way Arsenal backed their has been specialist in failure for the last 14 years with no proof of success.

There’s no doubting the progress under Jose. I wouldn’t take that away from him.

- Improved league positions, better goal scoring stats, improved individual productivity. An improved transfer policy. CL qualification.

- The club is not as toxic, we have won trophies and can still finish 2nd with a FA Cup in hand.

In fact it is difficult to sack Jose on the basis of the style of football and inconsistency alone. The progress made since LVG is there to see and at this point 2 years ago I was wishing death on LVG and I am not as bitter and miserable today.

We are stable, however, the issue is we have become inconsistent. Therefore we have also stagnated.

The style and substance of our football has not massively improved since Last Season. We still lump the ball, we still pass slowly along the backline. We are still too pragmatic and cautious.

We haven’t let the shackles off and scored handfuls over a long period, the defence is still a pick n mix of whoever is fit rather than who is the best.

We don’t have a fixed 11 and barely any of the players have developed partnerships with one another because we don’t have a fixed 11 or know our best players.

This is very unusual especially for a Mourinho side.

It’s a coaching and management issue. Jose bought Alexis with no plan, he bought in Lindelof and that was a massive error as he is our worst defender. He’s brought in Pogba and has tried to change his game. He doesn’t know how to coach Shaw or Rashford or Martial, he certainly doesn’t know how to nurture trust between – a young player/coach as the performances show that Shaw can’t get in despite being miles better than Young. Rashford/Martial get regularly shafted from bench to right wing whenever they do find their strides. Alexis has completely bombed their form. Jose is in fact making errors on both ends of the pitch.

This physical approach to the game clearly doesn’t work and is very outdated. Guys like Mata and Lingard will get overlooked for lumps like Felllaini who are not even committed to the club or fully fit. Jose allowed the presence of an injury prone player torpedo Scott McT, Carrick, Pogba, Mata onto the bench to everyone’s horror.

Jose has managed to trust very limited players with basic instructions rather than coach great players into producing quality performances. We see the trust he puts in Smalling, Valencia, Young, Fellaini, Jones but we don’t see the same stubborn stance put into developing young players like Tuanzebe,Fosu Mensah, Shaw, Pogba, Martial, Rashford into being the best versions of themselves in their natural positions.

Why is Lindelof here?

Why does Sanchez play regularly if he’s not better?

How has Scott, now Fellaini usurped Pogba?

Why are guys like Lukaku and Sanchez immune to rotation?

Does this only become frequent in a 2nd season and why the bias?

How are Fellaini, Blind, Darmian on the books? None have a future here yet we find kids on fringes and loaned out in Valencia,Palace and Villa, will they get a look in? When will they get the fair chance afforded to lesser players.

Massive coaching and management flaws in Jose. The rap sheet is growing.

The lack of forward adventure and service. We have Sanchez coming deep, Lukaku isolated to 2/3 chances a game. Lukaku doesn’t have a clue who is behind him most weeks. It’s literally Sanchez because he is on 400K wages then chaos predicting who fills the other 4 slots. Sanchez receives preferential treatment despite contributing next to nothing. We look absolutely clueless in terms of chemistry and cohesion in midfield and attack. We looked great for a little while until Sanchez arrived. We had a familiar side, not anymore, we have taken steps back since his arrival.

The defence is instructed to lump the ball rather than play the first time pass. Way too many touches. Not enough coaching or detail is put into build up play and we are regressing now. The midfield comes so deep and cannot rely on defenders to move it forward independently. I remember the days when Vidic and Rio stood behind the half way line and passed to two sitting #6’s who protected them while the other 6 players bombed forward and we had hard working players on the back foot.

Now we see 6 players in our own half camped and 2 coming deep to collect the ball, leaving Lukaku and someone else do the everything. It’s like we are not coached at all in possession, attacking or getting forward to stretch sides and threading passes in behind strikers, we are not keeping the width and coming narrow and deep. Nobody is getting in behind and past Lukaku to stretch defenders and put them on the back foot and not one player in combining successfully with the other to move around stationary defenders.

Our football up till now is very amateur and low level . There is no method to us circulating the possession, dictating the shape of opposition. We have some moments of looking like Arsenal with all our samey #10’s all lumped in behind Lukaku but it’s so chaotic, the ball ends up back with Smalling lumping the ball to Lukaku or De Gea to Fellaini. Route 1 football is our most lethal method of scoring. 2nd balls seem like the only thing we do in training.

The foundation of improvement is a confident defence and midfield that can hold possession and dictate the game. Smalling is shaking in his boots. They all make the easy pass. Valencia and Young are predictable, they dither and dither and hesitate. Where is the conviction and confidence? At present Smalling, Jones, Young, Valencia have been here 8-9 years now, their best days are gone, they are no longer consistent, talented or potential. They are just drifting here like deadwood, I consider Bailly, Shaw, Fosu Mensah, Tuanzebe as qualified replacements. If Mourinho is to succeed here, he needs to do what Pep Guardiola did and invest heavily in 2-3 defenders to join the likes of Rojo, Bailly, Axel, Mensah,Shaw. Out with Darmian, Lindelof and Blind. I’ll be dumbfounded if we can’t sell 5/6 defenders this summer and bring in at least 3 first team replacements.

The midfield is non-existent. Matic at times is just disjointed from the attacking players and can’t find a player in sight. We should be thanking our lucky stars Fellaini and Carrick are going. Frees up more funds and space for Scott McT, Andreas Perreira and hopefully a quality midfield signing. If Mourinho can’t identify with that he is a bigger fool than we know.

Fans only accept Jose’s dire football because it produces results. But how inconsistent are we? The Leicester game fucking haunts me, as does the Huddersfield game, the Stoke game just feels like an early season slap and I’m pretty sure we had a streak of LVG/Moyes form when we couldn’t win a game in weeks and needed to see action in the January window then got battered by Spurs and Newcastle. At worst or unluckiest, we should be 7/8 points behind a superior City side. But to be this far behind, with our dire style is just an insult to our intelligence as football fans. We might be 2nd, but in context it is shambolic we are out the race by January and 16 points behind.

The way I see it is if Jose is inflicting long term damage on Manchester Utd, we have to throw him under the bus. I think Woodward has to keep his eye wide open.

If one of Shaw, Martial, Pogba, Rashford, Alexis hand in a transfer request, if I were Woody, I would sack Jose . The club has to come first and those players are our future, Jose is not, not now not ever. He is a short term managerial appointment and always has been. He is simply here to do the job LVG couldn’t. Where we are right now, we can afford to lose Jose, player power revolves around Pogba + Sanchez but Jose has oppressed those threats. If the worst was to happen, it would be justified to side with the players to put the club’s future in stable position.

I’ve said It before, I don’t trust Jose’s judgement of talented young footballers, nobody should, it’s not his forte, if he does too much damage, we have to act quickly and responsibly . Let’s remember he isn’t Sir Alex Ferguson. The only way he survives is to deliver trophies, good football and to give youth a chance. The job is not too big anymore. Thanks to Jose, we are in better shape today than we were in 2016. Another man can come in and build on those foundations if Jose is not capable.
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17-03-2018, 09:01 AM (This post was last modified: 17-03-2018 10:10 AM by Costas.)
Post: #71
RE: [Champions League] Man Utd vs.Sevilla (13/03/18) 2nd Leg KO Stage
What heritage is he talking about anyway? He whines that Guardiola inherited Aguero, Otamendi, Silva, Sterling and Fernandinho. Mourinho inherited no Aguero, but don't tell me that back in 2016 we didn't consider Smalling, Mata, Martial and Herrera as good (if not better) than Otamendi, Silva, Sterling and Fernandinho respectively. On top of that, Mourinho inherited the best goalkeeper in the world, Rashford and experienced players who have won many titles (Valencia, Young, Carrick and Carrick). He had a good crop of players that he could build his big money signings around. The difference between Mourinho and Guardiola, and I'll never get tired of saying this, is simple: Guardiola maximizes players' potential. Mourinho doesn't. Our squad in 2016 wasn't that worse than City. It has just been made to look far worse by a negative manager who can't even get the best out of his own signings! Well, lets look at the players HE brought in and what HE did with them:

- Ibrahimovic: Was only a 1-season signing really and as such he was a hit.
- Bailly: Unbeatable on his day, but far too reckless and injury prone.
- Mkhitaryan: A very gifted player who Mourinho destroyed with his style of play and poor man managament. Sold after 18 months. Flop.
- Pogba: Mourinho broke the bank for him, but stubbornly refuses to play him in his best position. On top of that, he seems incapable of getting Pogba motivated. Notice that when Mourinho was talking about good players his successor would inherit, he made no mention of Pogba. Flop.
- Matic: A hit.
- Lukaku: A hit.
- Lindelof: A flop until now and it says a lot that Mourinho only trusts him if he can't play anyone else.
- Sanchez: A flop until now. Lets just call him "the extension of Mkhitaryan". A gifted player who Mourinho has no idea how to get the best out of. Even worse, bringing him in has ruined other players' momentum.

8 signings. 3 of them (Ibra, Matic, Lukaku) would be categorized as successful, 2 would be labeled as flops (Mkhi, Pogba) and 3 would be classified as question marks because we still don't know where they will end up (Bailly, Lindelof and Sanchez). That's not a magnificent succession rate by any means.

He has failed to get the best out of his own signings and he has failed to get the best out of most of the players he inherited. Yet he keeps blaming everyone but himself. When should he be judged? After he has spent 1 billion buying new players and replacing most of the players HE signed with new ones because he couldn't get the best out of them (like he will with Mkhi and Pogba)?

But his worst moment by far yesterday was his attempt to build up Sevilla and tear down his own team just to excuse his failure on Wednesday. The arrogant prick actually said that most Sevilla players would walk into the Man.United team (imagine being a United player and hearing this garbage from your own manager).. Barcelona and Real want nothing to do with these players, but they are good enough for United. I guess because according to Mourinho, United's level is being 5th in Spain. There's one area where Sevilla far outclassed us: Being a cohesive unit and playing as a team. And guess whose fault it is that United are neither. On top of that, he says that in the last 7 years Sevilla have been more successful in Europe. Yes, in the Europa League. If this is the level we are judging. Meanwhile, Sevilla have been nobodies in the Champions League. They just made the quarters of the Champions League for the first time in 60 years. A feat that even Moyes accomplished with ease 4 years ago. Sevilla got dumped out by fucking Leicester last season. And our manager, after all the millions he has spent, comes out and says that it's normal that Sevilla would eliminate us. Pathetic.

From now on, don't blame the players for lacking effort. If I was one of them, I wouldn't want to give my all for this fucker either.
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17-03-2018, 10:55 AM
Post: #72
RE: [Champions League] Man Utd vs.Sevilla (13/03/18) 2nd Leg KO Stage
Costas

Its all deflection. Not one of those points justifies he's poor management last game or the bad performance. It doesn't even justify why we play like boring cowards.

Pep inherited Kompany, Fernandinho, KDB, Sterling, Aguero,Yaya. But the rest he bought or improved. Like Sterling and Otamendi. Look at how Rashford/Martial are being treated in comparison. Or the lack of improvement in our defenders in comparison Otamendi who was no better than Bailly when he initially joined. We all know Jose inherited a poor team, but he's had the time and money and has not spent as effectively, efficient or as heavily as Pep and that is his failure. We clear needed more than 8 signings, we needed a dozen and we also needed to be ruthless and sell aging players and players that are far past fulfilling their potential like Jones, Smalling, Darmian, Blind. I frankly don't know why Young, Valencia, Carrick, Fellaini are still here. We needed experience and we signed Lindeflop. This is all on Jose.

The manager is running from the truth and deflecting blame.

Sevilla are not a great team yes they have good players like Banega, NZonzi, Lenglet but that is 3/22. How embarrassing is Maureen??

We lost because we are badly coached,poor selection, outdated approaches and bad tactics.

Its his job to motivate players and manage them and squeeze the best out of them.. But he's clearly destroyed Pogba, he's having a bad affect on Sanchez, Shaw, Rashford, Martial and he's overlooking players based on merit and choosing players on bias.

If his delusion carry on to the pitch, then we do have to replace him. Until then we have to bite our tongues because Maureen is boring, whining bitch and that will never change.

I wouldn't give him a 3rd season, a cheatah never changes his
..
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17-03-2018, 03:40 PM
Post: #73
RE: [Champions League] Man Utd vs.Sevilla (13/03/18) 2nd Leg KO Stage
Papii, you know what's the sad part? There are United fans out there who actually think this rant was a deflection, not for himself, but for his underperforming players. How can this be the case when he has thrown them under the bus repeatedly during that rant? Hell, we mocked Benitez for his rant but at least he was protecting his team. Mourinho's was all about self preservation and anyone with even one brain cell can see through it now.

As for giving him a 3rd season, I wouldn't give him one either. Mainly because I don't see how most of the locker room will keep playing for him. And it's not like we can change all the players instead of him (even if we did, he would still underutilize the new players!). But sadly, I'm afraid he will get a 3rd season because he just signed that extension and because we don't have anyone better lined up to take over (even Bayern are stuggling to find a worthy manager for next season). I'd love to get Allegri if he leaves Juve, but that decision might not come until June.
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17-03-2018, 07:04 PM
Post: #74
RE: [Champions League] Man Utd vs.Sevilla (13/03/18) 2nd Leg KO Stage
(17-03-2018 03:40 PM)Costas Wrote:  Papii, you know what's the sad part? There are United fans out there who actually think this rant was a deflection, not for himself, but for his underperforming players. How can this be the case when he has thrown them under the bus repeatedly during that rant? Hell, we mocked Benitez for his rant but at least he was protecting his team. Mourinho's was all about self preservation and anyone with even one brain cell can see through it now.

As for giving him a 3rd season, I wouldn't give him one either. Mainly because I don't see how most of the locker room will keep playing for him. And it's not like we can change all the players instead of him (even if we did, he would still underutilize the new players!). But sadly, I'm afraid he will get a 3rd season because he just signed that extension and because we don't have anyone better lined up to take over (even Bayern are stuggling to find a worthy manager for next season). I'd love to get Allegri if he leaves Juve, but that decision might not come until June.

Heynckes does not want to keep managing and they have been trying to convince him to stay another year but if not, most rumors say Thomas Tuechel will take over. It’s weird, I would have taken Carlo in a heartbeat if he hadn’t signed with Bayern before we fired LVG but he just didn’t work out there. I know churning managers shouldn’t be first choice policy but Bayern made the change early this season and brought Jupp back and he immediately got them playing well (and not losing at all). Just like Benitez at Madrid just didn’t work before half the season was gone and they pulled the trigger and put Zidane in charge. Who leads them to 2 champs league titles and is on course to compete for a third. I’d prefer to find another long term manager but maybe football has changed too much.

Would anyone here take Carlo next season if we stumble in FA Cup or shockingly drop out of top four? It seems the ony guaranteed EPL winner if you give him all the money he wants is across town. Allegri has proven himself and conte worked out with Chelsea. Rumors that Napoli coach could be pried away with the right offer and they were the only team to give City trouble at the etihad in group stage and he is attack minded as well. Just seems we are running out of time to have our onfield performances match our commercial success if we don’t keep progressing from where Jose has brought us since LVG. Maybe we need to steal someone from Madrid or Barca to replace woody’s non commercial duties and develop the vision for the future.
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18-03-2018, 12:59 AM
Post: #75
RE: [Champions League] Man Utd vs.Sevilla (13/03/18) 2nd Leg KO Stage
Buffalo -
Carlo isn't as promising a prospect as he used to be. The way things are, the United job is becoming harder and harder and requires a big character with alot of energy and hunger. Dare I say it.... we need a young manager who dares to dream a little bigger than Mourinho, LVG and Moyes. All three appointments have eventually fulfilled every flaw identified in their managerial careers. Jose is a whiny, negative, over pragmatic, anti youth, short term manager. Van Gaal was a drunk, tyrant, a bastard who was in denial and deserved everything that came his way, completely delusional and bonkers. Moyes proved to be small time, small minded underachiever who never qualified for the positions.

We need a young manager and we need to try something new. I can't see past Leonardo Jardim or pochettino, both speak english, both like to develop young players, pressing football, attacking intense football while Jardim really is tied to the 4-4-2, two wing backs, two strikers, two inside wingers. The way he implements 4-4-2 is just fascinating, I don't understand it but he's a genius.
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18-03-2018, 10:53 AM
Post: #76
RE: [Champions League] Man Utd vs.Sevilla (13/03/18) 2nd Leg KO Stage
Jardim rebuilds

Pappii thanks for the insight. Googled AS Monaco and found this interesting article about all the different formations he has tried after losing so many players this year. Still has them second behind PSG. After this week you, Costas, and JC will like his final quote. PIcon_lol
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18-03-2018, 05:29 PM
Post: #77
RE: [Champions League] Man Utd vs.Sevilla (13/03/18) 2nd Leg KO Stage
There's always time to whine, Buffalo. Don't know what Jardim is on about. Icon_lol

Jardim is a weird one. I observed his work when he was in Greece during 2012-2013 and I'd lie if I said I saw a future United manager in him. He had Olympiakos first and unbeaten (which wasn't that big a task given that team's budget and influence among referees) but they weren't playing well. This will sound incredibly retarded given the job he's done at Monaco, but Olympiakos actually sacked Jardim in February because the fans didn't feel that they were entertained enough by the team! I didn't see him use many Academy players either.

That said, the Jardim that's been at Monaco over the past 4 years seems like a completely different animal. The guy has obviously honed his craft in every aspect and is producing far more entertaining and vibrant sides. I've been very impressed with him. He actually wrestled a league title away from PSG (there goes Jose's excuse about it being impossible to beat a wealthier side to the title). Could he do a job at United? He will certainly make us more entertaining than Joe does and the younger players will improve more. But I'm worried that Jardim will be unable to cope with some of the more established stars. Olympiakos was also a team full with big, by Greek standards, names and maybe that's one of the reasons why he didn't click over there. I might as for a lot, but we need a manager who will use youngsters AND blend them well with big names. To be honest, I think Arsenal might be a better proposition for Jardim.

Regarding Carlo, I was very surprised to see him flop at Bayern like he did. His 2nd seasons are usually not as successful as the first, but this was something different. While Ancelotti has the reputation of being a "player's manager", it seems like he completely lost the Bayern locker room. So my faith in him was a bit shaken, to be honest. Plus, he's another manager who will rely more on experience and we need a manager who will nourish Martial and Rashford right now.

I'd go with Pochettino. But good luck getting him to leave Spurs and Daniel Levy for us...
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18-03-2018, 05:30 PM
Post: #78
RE: [Champions League] Man Utd vs.Sevilla (13/03/18) 2nd Leg KO Stage
Oh and lest I forget: Sevilla, the team whose most players would walk into ours, lost 2-1 to 12th placed Leganes. Our manager looking more and more like a moron with each passing day.
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18-03-2018, 07:37 PM
Post: #79
RE: [Champions League] Man Utd vs.Sevilla (13/03/18) 2nd Leg KO Stage
Costas -
Regarding Olympiacos, wasn't Marco Silva also their doing a "great" job ?

Anyways you raised some interesting points about issues Jardim may have with big characters. To counter that with a recent argument I would say Jardim has displayed the ability to squeeze his best players into their more ideal positions and areas of the pitch without losing his vision of fast build up from back and quick transitions to attack.

However it's possible by the time Jose's gets fired he may have already forced big characters out the club. If we back Jose, I can see Pogba leaving, as well as Shaw, as well as Martial to Juve. We might sign good players but they won't have the high ceiling's of those 3. Perhaps Jardim won't have that issue of big characters and stars once Jose has inflicted enough damage to get himself fired.

I would prefer Jardim over Poch based on CL pedigree, trophies and ease of signing him up, His contract expires in 2020 and unlike Poch he doesn't seem so wed to his club.

I've gone off Ancelotti, but I think Allegri would be a great option too. He's developed players like Dybala,Pjanic, Sandro and although Juve's chiefs have bought and sold well and replaced players effectively, Allegri has bedded in those players well. He's used a variety of systems to develop Juve post Conte and Pogba.

The worry is mainly, our structure with Woodward is we are lacking a football director with long term strategy, vision and transfer policy to help coaches like Poch,Jardim, Allegri, Carlo etc. European managers are used to coaching what they have rather than scouting and concentrate more on the training ground and football pitch.

XSA in the past mentioned United require a manager to call all the shots. But that's not how it works,do we really want Ed Woodward to oversee the wellbeing of the squad and recruitment, vision and planning once we chop and change managers. A modern reality we have to face is, successful top level managers go through a 2-3 season cycle.

Woodward is not the continuity we need, a footballing man is. Frankly I think for this kind of role we need a real professional because the club has produced a ex player with those capabilities to be football director.

I don't know what's happened but the clubs links to Atletico's Andrea Berta have sadly gone quiet. I thought I read Jose was happy to work with him.
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18-03-2018, 11:37 PM (This post was last modified: 18-03-2018 11:40 PM by Costas.)
Post: #80
RE: [Champions League] Man Utd vs.Sevilla (13/03/18) 2nd Leg KO Stage
Yeah, Papii, Silva did a great job with Olympiakos too! He almost won the title unbeaten. Only lost one game after his team went down to 9 men. But Silva at the time already shows glimpses of the problems he faced in the future: He had no plan B and he bottled it in the crucial games (the Champions League home tie with Arsenal and the cup final). And then he quit the club because he didn't get the players he wanted. I remember hearing a few whispers that he could manage United in the future. God I hope not.

As for the football director and a complete restructure of the football side of the club, I fully agree. But it won't happen. For the same reason why Old Trafford hasn't been properly taken care of in recent years. It takes too much money and effort, with no immediate profit for the Glazers. A club that is interested in growing, like City, looks to develop a solid model that every new manager (exactly because they don't last long anymore) will adapt to and work within. That's where long term success lies. A club that is only interested in revenue, like Arsenal, just hires a manager with a proven track record to achieve the bare minimum. That's where we also are. All Woodward cares about is milking the cash cow and leaving the football to one man who's good enough to guarantee Champions League football. And yes, this model did work with Fergie, but Mourinho is no Fergie. No one we hire from now on will be Fergie. I am afraid that by the time the Glazers realize that living in past glories isn't enough for a club to maintain its huge fanbase and profits, City will be light years ahead of us.
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